Can’T Remember How To Ask A Question + The Question

[jiff]

due to non TDM injury, haven’t ridden my 4TX for over a year, but summer’s coming & keen to give it a go. It won’t  start (not electrical), & have been advised to get rid of the old petrol. Trying to get the tank off, & I need to disconnect the 2 pipes to the tap under the tank + one pipe that appears to go straight  into the underside of the tank. Is that pipe a ‘breather’ or what? where does it go? do I pull it off/out from the tank? ……Help!……Thanks, Jiff

[dapleb]

Hey Jiff,





Before you get too involved in tank removal. What is happening when you try and start?

[jiff]

 Hi Daps.……boosted by  jump leads from the car ( engine running ) the bike spits and bangs irregularly…. maybe fires twice,

( I mean for just two sparks, never ‘runs’) then back to sptting & banging on the starter. Took the plugs out, they appear to be     gingerish, sooty, and a little wet.

[LAURENCEAUX]

Ethanol is hydroscopic, meaning old fuel can absorb water vapour over time, which settles in the tank to give a water-fuel interface. Perhaps you are trying to start the bike polluted with water and a drain and full top-up with fresh fuel may get the old girl going. 

 

Injectors may be gummed a bit, so a splash of Redex my facilitate smooth running again.

 

Good luck.

[srmoutinho]

Ethanol is hydroscopic, meaning old fuel can absorb water vapour over time, which settles in the tank to give a water-fuel interface. Perhaps you are trying to start the bike polluted with water and a drain and full top-up with fresh fuel may get the old girl going. 

 

Injectors may be gummed a bit, so a splash of Redex my facilitate smooth running again.

 

Good luck.

4TX has carbs not injectors.

 

Jiff i bought a TDM about 3 years ago, after a few months it was running a little rough, (but i did not have any trouble starting it) so i decided to take the tank out.

My process was simple take pictures to where each pipe goes so that i could put it back together.

Started by turning the fuel tap to off position, loosen all the screws you have 2 sets on each side plus another in the end of the tank.

Disconnect the pipe on the tap and let the fuel go to a container (I still made a mess out of it)

Remove rest of pipes and remove tank.

Remove the 2 screws where you have the filter this will allow you to get to the gas that is below the intake.

The fuel filters are inside that piece if they show any sign of debris try to clean them.

In my case the tank was full of rust and the last gas i managed to remove was really smelly. 

To remove some of the rust i added about 1 or 2 liters of gas shake the tank and drain the contents repeated this process a couple of times.

In the end i had to dipose a couple of liters of stale gas and a significant amount of rust.

Re assembled everything, get a couple of liters of clean gas and bike started working much better, my guess was some rust was clogging the filters.

[fixitsan]

I had a 3VD which had similar symptoms, caused by dirt in the fuel pump.

[Pedro]

Instead of taking the tank off, siphon the petrol then undo the drain screws on the carbs till empty. A long thin screw driver will be needed. Stick a good few litres of fresh petrol, give it a TDM blowjob* and if everything is ok, it should start. Btw, yes, that pipe under the tank is the breather pipe and just pulls off.





*TDM blow job = short length of pipe into the tank, wrap a rag around the opening to form a seal around the pipe and blow like a hooker. Forces the fuel into the carbs and saves the battery from having to spin the engine in order for the vacuum pump to work.

[dapleb]

Aggrozzle Pedro.



I suspect this is the TDM simply grumbling at you for its long time of inactivity. I have just started mine after 8 months off (illness and winter). Same fuel (albeit ethanol free) and it grouched for a few minutes (until the fool pamp has done it's thing) and then burst in to life.



If you want to change the fuel (which may be contributing to problem to a small extent) then a jiggle siphon and syringe or turkey baster will accomplish that. Well it did for me after brimming the tank with diesel!!



I would definitely make sure you have a full charge in the boike battery and then follow Pedros plan.



How much fuel do you have in the tank?



Did you turn the fuel off at the tap prior to its rest?

This post was last modified: 10-03-2022, 11:06 AM by dapleb.

[marko67]

I'm with Dapleb and Pedro.

 

To my shame I've left my bike sitting for months and had the same problem. A few times.

 

Usually the bike has had less than half a tank of fuel so I topped it up with fresh and cycled it through on the starter a few times. Let it sit for a few minutes and repeat.. Bike has always fired up if the battery is in good nick. Admittedly usually just one cylinder to begin with but the other chimes in when the bike warms up properly.

Then I take it out for a damn good thrashing.

[jiff]

…….Oh Thanks All….for the encouragement, empathy, wisdom, proposals, mirroring of experience etc…….

 

I’ve got the tank jacked up, a couple of new plugs, and an old tooth brush to sweep away the surrounding crap before plug-swap.

since I’m not clear about which pipe does what , and hence am wary of tugging at them, even with the fuel tap in ‘off’ mode,

I’m going to try siphoning out old petrol (turkey baster - brill !)…..and pouring in some fresh gas….

 

wish me luck…..and stand back, ‘lest I light the blue touch paper………still on jump leads as no lectric in my (remote) garage,

and didn’t want to additionally be-labour myself with the old battery removal tango.

[Pedro]

Jiff, just so you know, even with the tap off, if you pull the pipes off from under the tank, you will rinse your bike with petrol. The tap is after those two pipes. Guess how I found out!



Off subject but...... I used to know a lesbian couple who had a baby by using a ..........

[wicklamulla]

Jiff, just so you know, even with the tap off, if you pull the pipes off from under the tank, you will rinse your bike with petrol. The tap is after those two pipes. Guess how I found out!



Off subject but...... I used to know a lesbian couple who had a baby by using a ..........

 

 

yep me too,  they lived happily ever after and went touring on their TDM 900's of a weekend.

[jiff]

…….Well !…..for those of you still awake / hanging on my every dribble…

Contrary to predictions, and having freed the tank, I turned off the petrol via the two-position tap on the underside of the tank,

(not the accessible one by your left knee)

Then gingerly pulled off the two pipes from that tap (marking which was which), and also the third (breather) pipe from the underside of the tank……….. no disaster so far….no torrent of liberated gasoline.

Removed the tank and funnelled the old gas into a handy plastic can (my friendly local spannerman Jules, will use it for cleaning 

greasy / oily things). Then tipped away any remaining via the filler cap ( shaking the tank upside down, there was ‘a rattle’ - rust?

>left it to sit, for a while, rattle vanished.

Used old toothbrush to remove muck around plug caps, removed plugs, noticing that, on both, the expected little screw-on widget at the top has, presumably, remained (trapped) within the plug cap,? - in spite of being threaded. My other friendly local (bike) spannerman suggested superglue on plug thread then screw plug back into lead, and leave for a while , hoping to re-unite plug & widget…. nice idea, sadly didn’t work. Put new plugs into the head, noticing they came without said widget. Reconnected plug leads in this state. Reinstalled the tank (underneath tap back to ‘not off’)

Put in  a few litres of petrol. Pressed starter (jump leads still necessary)……engine fired up lovely..

Havent’, gone anywhere yet….not sure whether leads will remain in contact with plugs.

Please forgive my long epic……..thought it might be helpful to someone else….in future……meanwhile watch this space…. or not!

[dapleb]

Well done jiff, glad you and the boike are back in action.

[Studley Ramrod]

Well done Jiff, :drinks:

[leehenty]

Some plugs don't use the little screw on bit depends on the plug cap type

[jiff]

Oh!…thanks Sir Henty….any way I can tell?…….the new plugs I got from Halfords (NGK) didn’t have the screw-on widget,

but the top is threaded….is that an either / or option?

Got it running briefly again this morning, but due to it p*ss*ng down, and my wobbly confidence due to more than a year out of the saddle, together with my short legs, decided not to venture out.

……talking of which, having had shorting probs. in the rain in the past, I had wrapped the junction of plug-lead and cap with self-amalgamating tape……seemed like a grand idea at the time and was effective, but I imagine the devil to remove with the restricted access available…..in order to inspect the plug cap insides with torch

The cap seemed to ‘click into place’ on the plug / in the plughole, with a feeling of positivity, so I’m hoping that it’s unlikely spontaneously disconnect on  the ‘trial run’……any further helpful comments gratefully received

[Snowbird]

That click is prolly the spring in the cap on the thread and sounds good to me, most caps these days don't need the spare bit.

[dablik]

Jiff, 850 plug caps dont need the little Top Hat "screw on widget"  under noraml circumstances, you would'nt fit the plug caps if they were in-situ..

[jiff]

……as ever, over flowing / whelmed with gratitude and appreciation of support / expertise from the assembled company….

simple & straightforward solution illuminated / arrived at with help from the aforesaid……vroom….vroom