Concerning Case Of Lorry Driver And Boike!

[dapleb]

I think that alot of boike roiders ride loike pie-locks and bikers often make themselves the victims when judging by some of the riding I see, they are often at least partly to blame....but just read this farticle!!!!

Court Appeal overturned a judgement that had been made in favour of a motorcyclist seriously injured in a collision with a lorry.

Basically a lorry driver had a load too big to fit on his own side of the road. So he was over the white lions. Lorry collided with boiker coming t'other way and boiker lost his leg. The first court ruled in boikers flavour but this was overturned on appeal. Because the boiker said that he was too close to the line as he cornered it was his fault!!!

Its the quotes, that if true, are very concerning!!!!!

Jonathon Watt-Pringle, QC for the lorry firm said the judge was "wrong to impose so high a standard of driving on the lorry driver" and "The collision occurred for one reason and one reason only, and that is because the claimant was driving right close to the centre when he accepted that the course should have been a very different one". [img]style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/blink.gif[/img] [img]style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/blink.gif[/img] [img]style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/blink.gif[/img] and I repeat [img]style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/blink.gif[/img]

Allowing the appeal, Lord Justice Richards said of the lorry driver: "A finding of negligence in this case would. to my mind, be to impose an unacceptably high standard on the driver".

So the moral of this story is its fine to admit you are riding on t'other side of the road but for gawds sake don't admit to riding on yer own side?

Scarey.

[buzz750]

Makes you wonder who the lorry driver knew and/or the size of the brown envelope. Arsehole of a judge.

[TDMTAM]

Aren't you taught to use the whole of your lane to gain a better observational position when riding and too make yourself more visable.

[Studley Ramrod]

Now, call me an idiot or whatever you will but, surely common sense would dictate that as the driver responsible for the vehicle that has the greatest potential for causing death and destruction, the highest standards of driving said vehicle should be applied.

The law is getting ridiculously stoopid and illogical these days, and the bikers & families seem to be the ones who suffer the most.

[Rallyist]

The only problem with looking at this is we are not informed of the whole facts, left or right hand bend? positioning can be good or bad dependant on this, if the rider was following road craft as in the advanced riding manual he had a crap brief.

[dapleb]

<!--quoteo(post=244406:date=Thu 7th Jun 2012, 11:48 AM:name=Rallyist)-->QUOTE(Rallyist @ Thu 7th Jun 2012, 11:48 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec-->The only problem with looking at this is we are not informed of the whole facts,<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->

Yeah I aggrozzle. This is my notes from an article from...well who knows. Its the quotes that concern me most and they would concern me regardless of the details!

[TDMick]

If the lorry was carrying a load that was imposing into the opposite carriageway, then outriders should have been used to warn oncoming road users.

Or a different route should have been chosen.

[Frajt]

<!--quoteo(post=244404:date=Thu 7th Jun 2012, 11:18 AM:name=TDMTAM)-->QUOTE(TDMTAM @ Thu 7th Jun 2012, 11:18 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec-->Aren't you taught to use the whole of your lane to gain a better observational position when riding and too make yourself more visable.<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->


Yes, but in conjunction with other mantras such as "Sacrifice position for safety" and "Preserve your safety bubble"

[NZTDMGUY]

<!--quoteo(post=244411:date=Thu 7th Jun 2012, 11:51 PM:name=Frajt)-->QUOTE(Frajt @ Thu 7th Jun 2012, 11:51 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec-->Yes, but in conjunction with other mantras such as "Sacrifice position for safety" and "Preserve your safety bubble"<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->

And stay alive and in one piece.

Cheers

[TDMTAM]

<!--quoteo(post=244411:date=Thu 7th Jun 2012, 12:51 PM:name=Frajt)-->QUOTE(Frajt @ Thu 7th Jun 2012, 12:51 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec-->Yes, but in conjunction with other mantras such as "Sacrifice position for safety" and "Preserve your safety bubble"<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Of course [img]style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/good.gif[/img]

[andysymmons]

Being a lorry driver and a biker, i can see both sides, the lorry presumably carrying a wide load would have been driver slower than normal and depending on the degree of the bend would depend on how much of the opposite lane he was using, if indeed he was carrying a wide load then as said he should have had an escort and flashing beacons

That said, I was always taught to ride in such a manner that i can avoid oncoming hazards, if said bend was a left for the bike then even if he was on the white line then he should have been able to see the truck in time to avoid it if he was riding in a safe manner.

But as said we don't know the facts so i blame the field of Alpacas

[Negwedar]

Like Moose, I am guilty of driving lorries and motorbikes, and have seen some bloody awful driving by truckers and bikers alike. We don't have all the facts here, but the legal assertion that an unacceptably high standard had been imposed makes a kind of sense, if you think about it. If your load is 10 feet wide, and your half of the road is only 9 feet, you're gonna stick out a bit over the lines, no matter how skilled you are, so you can't blame the lorryist's lack of skill for the collision. Damn shame about the biker losing a leg, but if you get into a fight with a big lorry you are going to lose. Please give us talentless numpties in HGVs a wide berth. Stay away from lorries, we sometimes can't see you when you're really close, and if you kill a member of the public, the paperwork is really time consuming.
I'm not Morgan Freeman, but thanks for listening anyway.

[Studley Ramrod]

So where do you draw the line ? Mayhaps it's ok to drive a lorry that's 16ft wide and gives the biker 4ft width ?

I agree wi' Dappers point, which isn't about who the guilty party is, and it's very worrying to think that the white line serves no real purpose in a court of law.

[dablik]

<!--quoteo(post=244693:date=Sun 10th Jun 2012, 11:32 AM:name=negwedar)-->QUOTE(negwedar @ Sun 10th Jun 2012, 11:32 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec-->Like Moose, I am guilty of driving lorries and motorbikes, and have seen some bloody awful driving by truckers and bikers alike. We don't have all the facts here, but the legal assertion that an unacceptably high standard had been imposed makes a kind of sense, if you think about it. If your load is 10 feet wide, and your half of the road is only 9 feet, you're gonna stick out a bit over the lines, no matter how skilled you are, so you can't blame the lorryist's lack of skill for the collision. Damn shame about the biker losing a leg, but if you get into a fight with a big lorry you are going to lose. Please give us talentless numpties in HGVs a wide berth. Stay away from lorries, we sometimes can't see you when you're really close, and if you kill a member of the public, the paperwork is really time consuming.
I'm not Morgan Freeman, but thanks for listening anyway.<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->

Yes it's terrible that somebody has lost a leg due to this incident,, but as a once upon a time truck driver i have to agree whole heartedly with negwedar,, well put m8.

[Trevini]

I've seen Moose ride a bike and drive a truck. I fear for the Alpacas [img]style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/hide.gif[/img] [img]style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/rotflmmfao.gif[/img]

To be fair, most of the truck drivers I have dealings with at work are pretty sensible, apart from the ex employee who planted a 20M cherry picker in a railway bridge. Bikers on the other hand, regularly don't do themselves any favours. It wasn't long ago at this years east anglian g2g that we were overtaken by a pair of knobs on a sports bike (we weren't going that slow ourselves) with the pillion pillock wearing t-shirt, shorts and flip flops. Coupled with riding like a twat, it's no surprise that the common assumption is that bikers involved in accidents are going too fast or at fault for some other reason.

We don't know all the facts, but on the face of it, it may have been at least partially the bikers fault due to not being able to adjust his riding position for whatever reason. Assuming (always dangerous) from the statement made, that the biker was too close to the white line, the driver was only just over the white line. The biker, in theory, should have had enough room to take evasive action. Still a shame for all concerned. Worse for the biker, but the other guy's got to live with it too.

[drumwrecker]

I have only skipped through the above thread so may be repeating a post.

I thought that a wide vehicle that took up more than a carriageway had to have an escort of some kind to warn approaching vehicles. I have often come across big fam vehicles being preceded by a car or van with some kind of warning on it. After all it is the driver's responsibility to ensure he can proceed safely. e.g. I f you reverse your car without having clear vision you would be responsible for any mishap. It is for you to get somebody to see you out safely. How come this rule didn't apply to this vehicle?

[stu]

<!--quoteo(post=244853:date=Tue 12th Jun 2012, 05:59 PM:name=drumwrecker)-->QUOTE(drumwrecker @ Tue 12th Jun 2012, 05:59 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec-->. After all it is the driver's responsibility to ensure he can proceed safely. ......How come this rule didn't apply to this vehicle?<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->

You could equally say that about the bike ......

[muir1848]

<!--quoteo(post=244427:date=Thu 7th Jun 2012, 04:18 PM:name=Moose)-->QUOTE(Moose @ Thu 7th Jun 2012, 04:18 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}><!--quotec-->Being a lorry driver and a biker, i can see both sides, the lorry presumably carrying a wide load would have been driver slower than normal and depending on the degree of the bend would depend on how much of the opposite lane he was using, if indeed he was carrying a wide load then as said he should have had an escort and flashing beacons

That said, I was always taught to ride in such a manner that i can avoid oncoming hazards, if said bend was a left for the bike then even if he was on the white line then he should have been able to see the truck in time to avoid it if he was riding in a safe manner.

But as said we don't know the facts so i blame the field of Alpacas<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->

I recall being told by the examiner (and instructors) when i passed my HGV1 that i woudl be expected to adhere to higher standards of driving than others due to being -1 a professional driver, and also in charge of a deadly machine due to its weight and szie and never to use the intimidating prescence of our vehicle to intimidate or force other road vehicles to give way.

I have also heard Sherrifs sentencing hgv drivers more heavily for issues such as speed and careless driving precisley due to reposnsibilites inherent in being in charge of a vehicle that may weigh 40 tonnes and be more thna 40 foot long

so i was surpised when i got to the bit about the comments about the lorry driver by the Judge